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Yes they give you the run around. Went toe to toe with them with our Ecoboost Flex. They don't just roll over and by the time your done with them your ready to drive your car through the showroom window.

On a positive note, we replaced our Flex with a Explorer and have had two years of trouble free ownership. Nothing wrong with my Focus motor.
 

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Yeah, that's...just incredible. I bought my ST after 10 years of an extremely reliable SVT, which I was reluctant to purchase at the time given other family member's so-so Ford experiences. But it really was the best thing I drove back at the time, and it's been an outstanding car that I'll be sorry to see go when the time comes.

I hope this guys gets his resolution...and I also hope that this is the case of the squeaky wheel getting the grease (or, in his case, not getting it). Just like only people who have polar opinions tend to fill out feed back surveys or submit reviews, I hope there are a million happy owners for each person put through the wringer like this guy...it'll make me feel better about my purchase (not that I'm regretting it).
 

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I blew the engine up in my ST and Fors has done everything short of kissing my butt. Unfortunately the car is still not done and it been more than a month. While its nice that they are taking care of me I think what's wrong is the length of time it taking to fix it.
 

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I blew the engine up in my ST and Fors has done everything short of kissing my butt. Unfortunately the car is still not done and it been more than a month. While its nice that they are taking care of me I think what's wrong is the length of time it taking to fix it.
This is the rare case when Ford proper screwed up as opposed to a dealership. There's no excuse for not having your spares lined up. If you can't spare it, you should pull some off the production line for just that purpose. I mean they've sold thousands of these cars and they don't have a few extra engines to cover stuff like this? If they have the spares and it's just that difficult to get them, that's a procedural fault and also Ford Proper's problem. :(
 

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Yea well I have heard nothing about the Coyote engines that were eating themselves either, but I know those were in the begining.
 

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Skimming most of the posts at the beginning and near the end of the thread, yes, it would suck to be in his shoes. It also sounds like a case of bad dealerships not properly diagnosing the root cause(s) why the engines were failing, bad luck, and partly how dealerships aren't corporate owned and Ford like nearly every other automaker can't snap their fingers for every single person having significant failures so now the few bad apples (dealers) are going to give Ford a bunch of bad publicity. Now that it apparently has been elevated and the significance of the multiple failures has gained visibility maybe he'll get some action but I doubt there will be a free replacement truck but Ford should be responsible for it being fixed properly. Anything beyond that and for lost time and use it will likely need to go down the court path.

Hearing stuff like this doesn't really sour me on Ford corporate as much as it reinforces poor dealers will never get my business. Gouge me in the parts department trying to sell at double list, don't want to do warranty work, treat me poorly and try to screw me over and you're going to get a lot of bad reviews. While Ford isn't alone in how they work with their dealer network they could stand to put more pressure on poorly performing dealers even if the dealers are moving lots of vehicles.
 
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My sales guy who I've bought 4 fords from over the last 10 years told me the other day one of the major headaches is they can't get parts to fix things. I'm not disagreeing with the fact that there are lousy dealers, but why put out TSBs and such on things that you don't have the parts available to fix. And with the new ecoboost engine (which the dealers hate because of the lack of ability to replace quickly) you would think Ford would have planned more of a back up repair stock in anticipation of launching new product. I know this ecoboost problem has lost Ford many long time customers and you can't blame that on dealers.

Case and point: my dealer is willing to do the motor mount TSB on my car by my word that there is a problem. Yes the drove with me but when they drove it without me they couldn't demonstrate the problem. They are willing to do the work and ordered the parts immediately ... but guess what? Can't get the parts. You gonna tell me that's the dealers fault?
 

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No spare sensors, no spare engines, no spare motor mounts, etc. Seems pretty standard for the new line up.
The ST has been out nearly a year and Ford is now production of the second model year...so not exactly new anymore. The 2.0 EB motor has been out a couple years now.

There really is no excuse at this point.
 

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For the lazy: Link to the 3rd blown engine

I agree with the fact that the dealer should share the majority of the blame, but it's Ford's fault too. I believe that if three engines blow, lemon law or not (he lives in Canada which apparently doesn't have a lemon law), Ford should replace the truck. However, I believe that the root of the issue lies with the dealer. All three engines have had similar failures with the same culprit. This is due to a lack of diagnostics... I believe that the dealer probably didn't want to spend all that time investigating a warranty claim, since they don't get as much money from Ford as they do from a customer, and just put a $10,000+ band-aid on it and sent the bill to Ford. IMO, this is one of the reasons why the Tesla dealer debate is so important... if we can remove restrictions on car sales (which shouldn't exist in the first place, with our supposed "free market" and all) Ford can be at the center of things and won't have to deal with a middle-man to deal with issues like these.

(Reading through this thread, I realized that Blackbird posted something very similar... so... TL;DR: I agree with Blackbird)
 

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I agree with most of what you guys are saying but who's going to fix it? Ford has to make the dealers better and stop sending them product that the dealers are either naïve about or don't have the means to support. It's not going to happen the other way around. Improvement starts from the top and flows down. The dealers aren't going to change unless Ford provides better leadership and closes the gap between some truly inspiring and innovative product and an absolutely broken customer experience. Sad but true. Quality control and customer support is the responsibility of the parent organization. They have to make it right or sales will drop and it won't matter how many blue ovals they send to dealers ... people will stop buying.
 

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I agree on some points. I have had excellent customer service on the few issues I've had. Where I think a large shortcoming shows is a lack of training the technicians on how to service the vehicles. They need to make sure the guys doing the repairs are familiar and trained on the systems and engines they're servicing.
 

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I agree on some points. I have had excellent customer service on the few issues I've had. Where I think a large shortcoming shows is a lack of training the technicians on how to service the vehicles. They need to make sure the guys doing the repairs are familiar and trained on the systems and engines they're servicing.
This is absolutely true. but who is gonna pay for that training and the time it takes to complete. If corporate doesnt back it its likely not to happen. dealers cant afford down time for traing unless its subsidized and mandated by the parent organization. In my field training is extremely expensive. folks dont usually volunteer to pay money out of pocket, take time off work unpaid to do training. but if its paid for without penalty to self they absolutely love the training!
 

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I agree. It's just a shame that Ford doesn't take a little more pride in that area and provide it. You don't have to train every technician at every dealership. If you have one or two that can handle it you're set.
 

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The problem is many dealerships place a high priority on profit over customer service. As long as they meet the minimum metrics to keep their franchise there really isn't much Ford corporate can do. Good technicians require higher pay and aren't always easy to come by in many smaller markets. Also for newer vehicles, some dealerships don't immediately make the investment in extra specialty service tools to make it easier to work on every model. When Ford changes or creates new tools, training programs, fields a new car with different powertrain it costs their dealer network a lot of money.

Back before they essentially killed off SVT-branded models like the last generation of the Cobra and Lightening, Ford did have special SVT certified dealers authorized to sell and recommended to service SVT models. It was a high buy-in for dealers and the customer service and other quality metrics were held to higher standards so not every dealer could participate and be eligible to sell and service the models. The dealers were required to have certified technicians that specialized in the SVT models and the dealer would need all the specialty tools for those vehicles.

After the SVT Focus came out Ford wanted to expand the amount of dealers those cars could be sold at so in late 2003 if I recall correctly they created a special SVT Focus certified program that allowed dealers to sell just those cars. It was less expensive and the requirements weren't as high but not as many dealers that weren't already full-line SVT dealers bought in (which didn't help improve sales that much). From my experience with a couple of these dealers they weren't much better and in fact I had better customer service a non-SVT dealer (i.e. not SVT Focus or full-line SVT certified).

While many of us would like to see a similar program of higher customer service and a special ST or SVT-like buying and servicing experience, the fact is the Focus and upcoming Fiesta ST really aren't the special, high performance models. Just like the 3.5L EcoBoost V6 in the link in this thread, those vehicles have a special engine but otherwise the powertrain is shared in other vehicles just like the Focus ST. So while Ford could created a special certification program, it wouldn't help all owners. And if you have a catastrophic breakdown and can't have the car towed to said specialized dealer you may still find yourself at a dealer with poor customer service.

A lot of Ford dealers are pretty good but the few at the bottom give a bad reputation to others. Sometimes you will find a poor dealer and other times the customers have too high of expectations and expect Ford to do things like replace vehicles, drop in an all-new powertrain, overlook modifications, etc. and then get vocal on the internet. That doesn't seem to be the case with this truck owner but if he's upset he should be taking it out against the dealers that screwed him over. Unfortunately being a realist there isn't much an individual can do other than publish their experience and hope money talks and poor dealers will be forced to improve or go out of business.

Ford like other automakers does try to help out owners to the extent they can but like previously mentioned the dealer network is completely separate from Ford Motor Company. The dealers have a franchise agreement that covers minimum metrics they have to meet to keep their franchise and even bad dealers can probably meet standards by doing a bunch of minor repairs well but still be able to butcher big ones on occasion. I'd like to see stricter control from Ford corporate but do you think dealers want to be told how to run their business, especially good ones?

It's a tough situation that automakers are continually looking at and trying to improve their customer satisfaction scores. With how many millions of vehicles sold every year no matter what they do some people will feel like they're screwed and maybe rightfully so. With the dealer model though and current programs and campaigns to improve service at dealers on a whole the dealer networks are better than they were years ago but the costs get much higher to improve those last, tiny amounts. Perhaps Ford like others will need to get creative and look at alternate ways to improve quality and service. It isn't just the dealerships, it's about the entire product lifecycle chain from designing better vehicles, better service techniques, self-diagnostics, repair tools, training, customer communication and more.
 
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I can back up Blackbird - There was a "probational" SVT Focus only set of dealerships. The one I bought mine from was godawful - did not get to sell any of the other models. Ended up driving to the other SVT dealer in the city to get reasonable service, and they were excellent while I lived in the area.

I know Tesla is taking some fire for owning their own dealer network, something I think is technically prohibited by law in most if not all states. However, I question whether it's a better way to go. I think Tesla, with their lack of existing momentum and leaner organizational structure, is going to be able to deliver better and more nimble service to their customers by owning their dealerships. But if Ford or GM or Toyota or whoever owned their dealerships, or owned them through a wholly owned subsidiary, what would that do for their customer service? Would it be more than they could efficiently manage? Or would it enable them do to quickly do the right thing for the 3.5L Ecoboost owner in question? Would it let us literally go online and order a car delivered right to the dealer? Would it increase transparency for things like vehicle availability, parts stock levels, etc? Would it lead to better accountability for botched repairs, would it remove the whole "warranty work doesn't pay so I'm not interested in your TSB" dance? I'm not sure.
 

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Good points all. Its a balance for sure.

To the point about good dealerships not being happy about how to run their business, sometimes the good ones have to give up a little control if it helps the larger organization by improving the bad dealers and bringing them all up to a better standard. We've had to do this in our organization to some degree and its really helped the lower end come up to standard.

But now straying off thread topic too much, sorry.
 
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